Will we get Magic Staffs in WotR?

I love wizards from the works of Tolkein and other great fantasy works to P&P D&D. There are wands, rods and Staves. When you see powerful wizards, you see a powerful staff.

A cool mechanic in some P&P required the wizard to unlock abilities in their more powerful staffs but that could be simplified. They make great lore.

That along with some really cool wizard robes would be nice. (and simple ones, black, red, white, green, blue etc. with hoods)

Staff of the Magi

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What about crafting them?

Yes please!

That’s the one thing I was really missing in Kingmaker, and so many other D&D(-ish) titles: proper weapons for Mages/Spellcasters.

I positively hate that my powerful Sorcerer is supposed to use a mundane crossbow, instead of having an imposing and powerful Magic Staff that can shoot a standard magic ranged attack instead of the crossbow’s bolts… just doesn’t make any sense why my caster would use such an uninspired weapon.

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not just staffs. the way they fight? combat animations? if only wizards can fight like gandalf like in the return of the king. that is freaking awesome.

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Even if I personally am more a fan of wands and crafting them

Well, i think the problem is cantrips. That you have them or at least that their progression is built in.

The staff would be to match regular attacks from those with regular weapons, which is what cantrips do.

I suppose you could argue that the cantrips is equal to unarmed fighting, but what would the staffs add to the cantrip?

My main problem is that I hate the fact my Sorc would have to use a stupid crossbow, so I’d like to at least give him something that looks like a staff.

But when I do that, my Sorc stupidly charges into Melee Combat automatically, because I have zero means to actually modify his AI behaviour.

So all in all, a completely unsatisfying experience… either the visuals are completely off (i.e. Sorcerer w/ Crossbow) or gameplay is completely off (i.e. Sorcerer enforcing Melee combat).
Magic Staffs would be the answer to both.

As for Cantrips, I don’t really see an issue here… balancing-wise it makes absolutely zero difference wether my Sorc is wearing a Crossbow that shoots bolts (which can also be magical and +3, etc) or if he had a Magic Staff that’d shoot magic (or even just physical) projectiles… it’s just flavor, in terms of balancing, but in terms of immersion, it is key.

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But when I do that, my Sorc stupidly charges into Melee Combat automatically, because I have zero means to actually modify his AI behaviour.

Well, there is the automatically used skill, but i suppose you might want to use something else there.

As for Cantrips, I don’t really see an issue here… balancing-wise it makes absolutely zero difference wether my Sorc is wearing a Crossbow that shoots bolts (which can also be magical and +3, etc) or if he had a Magic Staff that’d shoot magic (or even just physical) projectiles… it’s just flavor, in terms of balancing, but in terms of immersion, it is key.

It was more a comment on why magic users don’t have a weapon for their base attack (cantrips). They don’t need one, the attack comes from themselves and isn’t enhanced in any way by a weapon. And it was more about magic staffs as loot.

The mage overriding a quarterstaff or having a single “mages staff” (mechanically just a quarterstaff that enforces primary attack being a cantrip), is different from “magical staffs” existing as loot.

Magic staffs would be so cool.

Maybe give them ranged auto-attack and maybe per-day spell(s)…

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I would love to have Staff of the Magi in WotR it’s my all time favourite weapon

The game already has Quartersaffs why don’t you use them?

Id rather have an abundance of different weapons that up spellcasting. Of course staffs as well but Staffs dont have a ranged attack mode so they are melee weapons first so it makes sense the spellcaster uses a Crossbow or Sling etc.

They did mention a weapon companion, if it was a staff maybe the option to add additional spells per rest or per encounter would be something over other weapons.

I don’t see why you would use a crossbow or bow over a cantrip. Your BAB starts low and will become worse as the game progresses. Just spam those cantrips, or even grab trickster for the enhanced sneak attack damage.

Nonetheless, I saw a few magic staffs in the alpha and clips from the Gameplay videos that Owlcat released a few months ago, if you mean staffs that increase spell use per day or that cast spells themselves.

It depends on the situation and the build, of course, and cantrips vs. bows each have pros and cons.

  • Bows are not subject to Spell Resistance, you can have more than one attack per round, you can add your strength bonus to damage, the damage base is mostly superior, and either the critical range (bows) or multiplier (bows) is greater. Range is better as well. I don’t think there are antimagic areas in either game, but in PnP, they exist and a bow can help in those cases.
  • On the other hand, cantrips are touch attacks (which is great, especially for usually low-BAB spellcasters), are not subject to Damage Resistance, and for some casters, can have more damage type to circumvent ceratures’ specific resistances. They also have no weight.

I probably forgot several pros and cons, but that gives an idea about my point, which is that it never hurts to increase your possibilities.

Gameplay Meta aside, personally, I just hate the look & feel of a mighty Sorcerer having to use a mundane Crossbow… it just doesn’t fit. At all.

On the other hand, a staff that shoots a projectile with a suitable animation and hold style, that fits perfectly and moreover mechanically it would be 100% identical to a crossbow!

That latter point is the main argument why it just makes little to none sense to force casters to use mundane weapons like that… mechanically and balancing/rule-wise it makes 0% difference wether it’s a crossbow shooting metal bolts, or a staff shooting some kind of magical projectile, so long as underneath they are identical in terms of damage, CD and GCD, etc… or even different but balanced properly, for example with the staff’s magical projectiles having a small armor penetration bonus, or ToHit for magical creatures, whuteva, but in turn a lower damage value ([…]) than a crossbow’s bolt.

That way the look & feel would be 100% perfect (especially since those of you who for some reason prefer a crossbow-wielding-caster could still do that), the investment in terms of manhours should be relatively small as there’d only be a couple extra animations which also could largely be repurposed (magic missile projectile recolor and maybe resize, for example), but it would give those players who really care about these things a much improved immersion.

Win/Win.

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I vaguely like the low-magic look of casters who have to resort to daggers or crossbows, though.

If we had magic staffs that pew pew lazors (that were equivalent to crossbows in functionality and price), they would equip peasant armies with them and suddenly we have Star Wars.

One thing I would support, is a “wizards staff” that has a nonfunctional ranged attack, so if you accidentally turn off your cantrip your caster doesn’t run into the frontlines trying to melee. Maybe it can grant a small bonus of some sort (eg. +x damage to cantrips) so it’s not a complete waste of a slot.

Nope, they wouldn’t, as these Staffs could of course only be used by Casters, not by peasants.

A wizard would never use a magic staff instead of a crossbow, even if staves did exist. The crossbow conceals your identity as a wizard and your magic always gives the wizard the option of revealing himself. Surprise and anonymity are extremely powerful tools, and only a fool would give them up.

Staves are already in Pathfinder and have a few mechanics associated with them that would make it complex to implement:

https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/staves/