Voting Catfolk and How it makes for the Best Overall Game

I posted (a version) of this in the Vote Topic but decided to repost as a seperate topic for potential discussion.
In the I don’t really have a horse in voting race from the prespective of playing any of the races but I think that Catfolk are likely to result in the best overall game (and they seem to not have the fanbase of the others so being a contrarian is sometimes fun).

This will be split into three sections:

  1. Voting against Kitsune.
  2. Voting against Ratfolk.
  3. Voting for Catfolk.

Voting against Kitsune:
While Shapechange sounds like an interesting power - in practice it is likely to be meaningless in a primary combat game, with the exception that when some NPC reveals themselves to be ‘gasp’ a Kitsune it will result in you going “god damn it, I have met them with trueseeing active … why the hell don’t the spells work as they should!” or “unless they have the non-existant disguise skill in max ranks for a level higher then they are I should have auto-spotted through that with perception”.
Effectively Kitsune sounds cool but they have some items that are likely to merely detract from play and make it so your MC was a fool for not seeing through their disguise.
Alternatively it means a lot of work will be done on the Kitsune to be perfect … work that could be done somewhere else that may offer greater gameplay to a wider audience - including you if you don’t intend to actually play as a Kitsune.

Voting against Ratfolk:
It is true that Ratfolk do not have the same gameplay/development issues as Kitsune, whoever they are basically inferiour Halflings from the pure race mechanics offering effectively nothing new.
Now they could have the swarming mechanic - which is interesting, but would then result in a decent amount of development to allow for two characters to stand in the same place with issues for targeting etc.

Voting for Catkolk:
Catfolk offer two primary benefits, firstly they should not have any obviously annoying elements from a ‘but I should have noticed that’ stance and secondly they offer something a little different in terms of racial abilities without them being the type of things that need entirely new mechanics to implement properly.

So in conslusion if you don’t particularly care about Kitsune, Ratfolk or Catfolk then Catfolk would seem to be the likeliest to require the least updates to mechanics and thereby time cost of the team which could be used for other work that you may find preferable.
Also please note that if you have voted but wish to change your vote (whichever way) you can click ‘Show Vote’ under the results and change is as you like, you are seemingly not tied until the vote closes.

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I want either Ratfolk or Kitsune. Kitsune can shapechange into human form so are not locked out of romances and Ratfolk lore is by far the strongest of the three. Voted Ratfold to lessen the difference between the two.

Id really like to have a Ratfolk companion like Deekin in NWN that I can ‘reprimand’. Sort of like a mascot for the group. A Ratfolk merchant that hordes shiny items, maybe even have a unique Ability fo find added loot from locations only he can enter. Id be fun.

The Catfolk neither have the strong Lore nor anything particulary interesting and even though cats look cute, foxes do too. Only that foxes are rarely pets in real life so there are not-at-all that many pics showing cute little foxes.

Although I voted for Ratfolk Id never play one actually. But if the Race gets added, Owlcat will use it for a companion eventually so in this regard it made sense to vote for it. Its an asset that is there so its guaranteed to be used in (any) game.

Same could happen if the next game also has such a poll. I always have to consider any Race from both the main character AND the potential companion aspect. For this poll, I neither would like to play as a Catfolk main character OR have any Catfolk companions.

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True story :wink: :smiling_face_with_three_hearts:

I kinda agree with anything you said with the exception that I would really like to play as a Ratfolk Alchemist :ratfolk:
Catfolk is the less appealing choice in my opinion too, bringing almost nothing to the table for me (lore, mechanics, etc.). They are omnipresent in videogames and other media, they are not that solid lore-wise and mechanically they are really nothing to write home about, I would never play them over other classes.
It’s kind of a boring race choice for me personally.

Why is that so? They have different bonuses (among the others Ratfolk gets a +2 INT and Halfling a +2 CHA) if I’m not mistaken so they can be used for vastly different classes.

Exactly. They make even better Alchemist than Elves due to their Small Race adding +1 extra Attack Bonus. And there is a Racial Feat called Tunnel Rat that makes them a Tiny Race for fitting into tiny openings. I can already see my Ratfolk mascot crawling into a hole and getting back with some treasure or else … mgrgr

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Furry for President guys! xd

I think a lot of People are only focused on the shapeshift ability of Kitsunes when it comes to discuss their worth in pnp. But there are some other things i want to mention. Some Kitsunes have the special “Magical Tail” feat(3rd Party published), which provide them with some nice spells and on top of that improves the lore of the world, cause their race description (not only in Pathfinder) talks about their magical potential and the number of tails show how old/strong a Kitsune is. If they implement some visual effects based on this, then it shoud provide us with awesome characters. And this feat is not hard to add to the game in comparison to their shapeshifting ability (including companion /NPC reaction, skill checks…).
Second Kitsune maybe dont have the perfect reason to be in the worldwound and they are considered to be non.aggressive focusing on friendly Trickery and harmlos mischief, but thats where our enthusiasts of “exotic characters” come in. Everyone can play half-orc babarians or human warriors against the demon invasion, but some people might be bored, cause after Lord of the Ring, WoW etc. you have seen enough of these characters. Why not play something new? Instead of a brave warrior play a friendly kitsune trickster, who seems not really fit in this demon infested world, but he proofs his worth by other means. Well truth to be told, this argument goes for catfolks as well, but i think kitsunes deserve the “exotic” theme a little bit more. I will do at least one playthrough with a Kitsune rogue or bard. Shoud be funny.

And yeah i didnt mention ratfolk. Why? Because they are some little nasty ugly monsters like goblins I woud kill and burn just out of amusement even if I am a Lawful-good Paladin.

Have a nice day. xd

So many possibilities :star_struck:

But kitsunes are canines. :face_with_raised_eyebrow:

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Honestly I’d just make Catfolk a subrace of Kitsune, just cat instead of Canine, but otherwise like other Kitsune, with the shapeshifting and tails thing.

Either they are different races, as they are now, or they create a different “animal-human” type where you choose your form (foxfolk, catfolk, ratfolk, dogfolk, birdfolk, lizardfolk, fishfolk…) and have the same general abilities (and some subrace-related special ones), but making only Catfolk a subrace of Kitsune (or the reverse) makes no sense in my opinion.

Well I have done the honourable thing, and voted for Catfolk, even though they so in 3rd place, with no hope of winning the race war. :catfolk: