My (no-merc) party composition

This appears to be correct - I was intrigued so I tried it, and the Rage Powers simply don’t appear to work.

wow - that’s cool. I haven’t thought of pushing his defenses by taking a one level witch dip. :+1: :grin:

Two suggestions two further up the AC…

  • currently you can have your cleric cast magical vestment on Lann - it works, further boost up to +5
  • the ‘icy protector’-ring also works on him while shape shifted (further +2, if no other party member uses it)

… and some questions:

  • Would you do the Witch-dip immediately (for his 2nd char level) or get the druid going and splash that witch-level in later?
  • Any subclass of witch (I am not really familiar with the class) or doesn’t matter b/c just 1 level?
  • thinking hard how I could squeeze-in 2 lvl of vivi into my party setup for infusion/shield to enhance AC of Lann, Animal Companions and Sosiel. I think I will let Nenio take 2 lvls of vivi instead of just 1 (and do infusion rather cognatogen) - alternative would be Sosiel, but loosing 2 lvl of spell progression would hurt

I am sorry, but how? Is Shapechange in WotR? It wasn’t in Kingmaker.

Also, If we are discussing 1 level dips for a Shapeshifter Druid, you might consider Sorcerer instead of Witch. The crit immunity from bloodline ascendance is great.

1 Like

Level 9 druid Spell “Shapechange” lets you choose Dragonkind III

Agree - also a strong option.

That’s exactly my question. That spell was not implemented in Kingmaker. Was it added in Wrath?

sorry, I misread. Yes - spell is implemented and working (just double checked) :+1:

1 Like
  • currently you can have your cleric cast magical vestment on Lann - it works, further boost up to +5
  • the ‘icy protector’-ring also works on him while shape shifted (further +2, if no other party member uses it)

Good catch! I totally forgot that magical vestments works on no armor characters (at least in PnP).

  • Would you do the Witch-dip immediately (for his 2nd char level) or get the druid going and splash that witch-level in later?
  • Any subclass of witch (I am not really familiar with the class) or doesn’t matter b/c just 1 level?

I dip witch immediately but its more of a convenient thing really. Getting to level 4 druid is pretty important for this Lann to get going thou. As for the subclass, you want a familiar, level 1 spells (mage armor) and a hex. That eliminates Hagbound (no hex), Ley Line Guardian (no hex, no familiar) and stigmatized witch (she is charisma based and Lann has 9 CHA so no spells).

Sorcerer was something I considered but I find that this Lann can use a lot of mythic abilities (enduring spells, master shapeshifter, mage armor, < the thing thats reduces CC effects by one level >) so bloodline is difficult to fit in for me. Plus you have to get charisma going for mage armor or be stuck with the celestial bloodline and the later shape change forms grant crit immunity / < element of your choice > immunity anyway.

I’m thinking about fitting a level of loremaster in there if his “Secret” allows for a nice cleric / wizard buff spell. But I haven’t tried that yet so no idea how it actually works.

1 Like

I usually have Camelia as 1Fighter/1xShaman, which boosts her AC by giving her better shields. And early game Full Plate is better than anything else you can find.
Also Camelia is not True Neutral.
Also giving any frontline 1 level of witch will boost AC by 3, 2 from Iceplant and 1 from Lizard. For one of them Ice Ring gives +2 AC too.

1 Like

Be careful! Fencing Grace only works with bucklers in the offhand (or at least it shouldn’t work with heavier shields). I am pretty sure in the Alpha Fencing Grace worked correctly and only with an empty off-hand or with a buckler, although that was quite a long time ago.

Also, not sure if Lizard’s +1 AC stacks with Iceplant. Both are Natural Armor bonuses.

Wait, how do later shapechange forms grant crit immunity? Are you talking about elemental forms? I thought they were pretty lackluster in combat.

Thanks - that’s good advice!

I just tried it but loremaster is so completely bugged currently in WOTR so can’t even get 1 level in it (although all requirements met). According to this there don’t seem to be that great secrets - and Lann’s low INT (11) might even prohibit to get one of the (relatively) better ones. Doesn’t seem to be worth the extra-dip (plus required investments into skill fokus and metamagic feat)

they do stack - as do all natural armor bonuses. Natural Armor Enhancement bonuses (e.g. barkskin) don’t stack

From d20pfsrd:
A natural armor bonus improves armor class resulting from a creature’s naturally tough hide. Natural armor bonuses stack with all other bonuses to armor class (even with armor bonuses) except other natural armor bonuses. Those that do stack, such as DD’s natural armor bonus, mention it explicitly.

thanks - didn’t know this!

just tested the specific thing (lizard & ice plant) and they stack in the game

I thought so too. I am just being careful not to prepare a build that breaks in september.

Yeah that is why I use Weapon Finesse (Mythic).

2 Likes

Certainly a solution, maybe even worth it for the higher AC.

On lvl 4, if you dip 1lvl of Fighter and give her best Full Plate and best Shield her AC skyrockets masively for early game. After few levels can you find Medium armors that are better but until then.

Is full plate better than Lady Callandra’s? I guess that the decision here will be affected by who else in the party needs/wants good light armor.

Really interesting to read all this. I do really like the idea of Lann as a druid.

I have a question to those that understand these things: a lot of folks posting guides and builds are adding unarmed feats to their builds when clearly the characters are not gonna be fighting unarmed. For example one for Seelah at L3 says “Bard - Improved Unarmed // Combat Trick => Crane Style”.

Err…why is this?

Oh, and @The_Nightshade911 : who does your locks and traps?

1 Like

Because the improved unarmed-feat is a prerequisite for the Crane Style-Feat, which turns defensive fighting from “a horrible deal” to "just -2AB for +4 AC (if you have at least 3 mobility) " and is pretty much necessary for your tanks to reach good AC values. It is not really a thematical move - just a mechanical necessity.

Camellia does it - she has high dex and can afford to pump the skill at each level-up