How is damage calculated? Help please

Pathfinder: Kingmaker General Discussions
#1

I have a really hard time figuring out how damage is calculated. I normally just look at the weapons and the higher is better unless they might have some abilities etc. that I like.

So my main character is a dual wielding inquisitor and have tried to focus on that as best as I can when selecting feats to her.

But when i compare her to Nok-Nok which are also dual wielding, the numbers doesn’t really seem to add up (or at least I don’t know where they come from :D). I removed all buffs from them.

Main
Main750×442 123 KB

Nok_2
Nok_2750×442 120 KB

Clearly Nok-Nok have better weapons, as seen to the right when I hover over one of his weapons. And when adding all the numbers together it fits with the 7-20 base damage I guess it is and apparently when he uses it, it does between 23-35 damage.

But looking to the left under Attack, it say 1d3 + 20, where does the +20 come from? I have looked through his feats and there is only the Finesse training which allow him to add dex to damage instead of strength, but that is only +9 and maybe he might get +4 from the weapon so that is +13.

Comparing that to my main character, she only gets +5 or +4, however she also have the weapon finesse ability to use dex instead of strength when using light weapons. Yet it doesn’t seem that hers +9 is added to the damage shown. Since both her weapons are identical, I tried to give one of them to Nok-Nok and he adds +9 where she adds +5. And when I give her his weapon its +14. Is the “use Dex instead of strength” added several times or what since the weapon have “Agile”?

Does anyone know how these +X damage things are calculated, would be much appreciated.

#2

If you have Piranha Strike, at level 14 rogue, that would be another +6dmg (total of +19). So that’s only a +1 off of what you would expect which may be a simple bonus somewhere that you forgot.

You didn’t ask, but the 1d3 instead of 1d4 is because he’s small. I didn’t realize that the game did that.

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#3

Thanks.
Tried to turn that off and it is as you say, my main doesn’t have it. That is a very good ability.
Guess I have to respec her once again then :smiley:

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#4

Some information are missing for us to explain the +7 damages, but my guess is that Nok-Nok has the feat Piranha strike ON.

As for your main character, she just don’t have the class feat weapon finesse training short sword or a ‘‘agile’’ weapon to add her DEX to damage. So she still use her STR for damage.

Either you multiclass her into 3 level of rogue or you use weapon with the agile enhancement to add your DEX to damage.

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#5

Yeah it is the lacking Piranha skill, but if you are going to use dual wielding isn’t weapon finesse skill sort of useless to take, if you can get it for free on light weapons?

Also noticed that my main is trained in Elven curve blade, which I have never used and pretty sure is a two handed weapon anyway :smiley:

#6

You are talking about agile? It’s not the same as weapon finesse. It’s instead similar to the rogue class feat finesse training.

Weapon finesse
With a light weapon, elven curve blade, estoc, rapier, or spiked chain made for a creature of your size category, you may use your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier on attack rolls. If you carry a shield, its armor check penalty applies to your attack rolls.

Finesse Training (Ex)

At 1st level, a rogue gains Weapon Finesse as a bonus feat. In addition, starting at 3rd level, she can select any one type of weapon that can be used with Weapon Finesse (such as rapiers or daggers). Once this choice is made, it cannot be changed. Whenever she makes a successful melee attack with the selected weapon, she adds her Dexterity modifier instead of her Strength modifier to the damage roll. If any effect would prevent the rogue from adding her Strength modifier to the damage roll, she does not add her Dexterity modifier. The rogue can select a second weapon at 11th level and a third at 19th level.

Agile

#7

In general for two weapon fighting build that don’t have access to agile weapons or 3 levels of rogue, you want to go high STR base and use DEX item to reach the dex requirement for imp. two weapon fighting and greater two weapon fighting.

15 base DEX is enough, but you have to keep dex item on you for improve / greater two weapon fighting to be active.

#8

Yes, Nok Nok as a rogue adds his dex instead of str to melee damage, plus he has sneak attacks so he does lots of damage.
Other options would be:

  • You are a ranger or slayer with lots of str and you use your combat style feats to bypass the dex requirements for dual wielding feats.
  • Slashing/piercing grace adds dex to damage for one weapon type but it works only when you are not dual wielding or using a shield. This may be interesting for sword saints, aldori defenders or duellists.

Unless you have 3 levels of rogue or you are a ranger/slayer with lots of str and dual wielding style it is better to be a str based character instead of a dual wielder. 2h weapons give you the 1.5x str bonus for damage and there are many spells that increase str. Spells that make you bigger increase both str and weapon damage.

If you get bigger your weapons do more damage and you gain str, but you lose dex and your AB and AC drops.
If you get smaller your dex increases and you gain AB and AC, but you lose str and your weapons deal less damage.

#9

I tried to make a STR dual wielder using longswords and Scimitars and guess that could work, but I do feel like my current inquisitor being Aasimar probably benefit more from Dex. Having to keep a high dex at the same time as a high STR when you also want constitution, given that if your main character dies you have to reload. So also “force”, not because its bad to take the toughness feat. So it just seems like im closer to getting the feats for the dual wielding, if I focus on Dex.

Im not really going to much after the best of the best, just functional :slight_smile:

And I want my character to be a dual wielder with a wolf, im pretty sure, she would be better just using a bow or as you say go for a two handed weapon and maybe even another class. I am still very much into roleplaying the game rather than trying to min/max stuff.

But with all the abilities, stats requirements and class skills etc, its not easy to keep track of all of the stuff and what is needed. But I want my characters to at least make use of the stuff the have, and it didn’t seem like my main character really did.

When using Nok-nok weapon she does get the +20 damage, while still maintaining a +19 to hit which I think is fine, when she gets buffs etc. Now I just need to find some better weapons for her.

#10

Yes, to stress again the importance of Piranha Strike (or Power Attack if it was a STR-based combattant) in all cases, and Agile Weapons if you don’t take levels in Rogue. At 14th level Inquisitor, you’re looking at -3 Attack/+6 Damage for each attack. -4/+8 at level 16+.

Then, better weapons.

Maybe Outflank feat for all your melees to add to your attacks and help compensate the penalty of Piranha Strike.

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