Fix Flat Footed

First of all, credits to Holic92 and Tyrir on the Pathfinder: Kingmaker Discord group for unearthing this and helping with the wording.

It looks like Being denied Dexterity bonuses to AC makes you flat footed in Kingmaker, while it’s the opposite in PnP (pencil and paper) Pathfinder. We have no idea how close to the actual PnP rules you want to be, nonetheless I feel like it’s a good thing to let you know and then decide.

In Tyrir’s words:


The following code is used in determining whether sneak attacks can be applied in Kingmaker:

 public override void OnTrigger(RulebookEventContext context)
    {
      this.IsFlatFooted = this.ForceFlatFooted || !this.Target.CombatState.CanActInCombat && !this.IgnoreVisibility || (this.Target.Descriptor.State.IsHelpless || this.Target.Descriptor.State.HasCondition(UnitCondition.Stunned) || !this.Target.Memory.Contains(this.Initiator) && !this.IgnoreVisibility) || (UnitPartConcealment.Calculate(this.Target, this.Initiator, false) == Concealment.Total && !this.IgnoreConcealment || this.Target.Descriptor.State.HasCondition(UnitCondition.LoseDexterityToAC)) || (this.Target.Descriptor.State.HasCondition(UnitCondition.Shaken) || this.Target.Descriptor.State.HasCondition(UnitCondition.Frightened)) && (bool) this.Initiator.Descriptor.State.Features.ShatterDefenses;
    } 

This doesn’t reflect the PnP rules accurately. Sneak attack can (generally) be applied when dex bonus is denied to AC or when flanking per the Sneak Attack class feature:

Sneak Attack:
The rogue’s attack deals extra damage anytime her target would be denied a Dexterity bonus to AC (whether the target actually has a Dexterity bonus or not), or when the rogue flanks her target.

The Flat-footed condition is only one of several situations where dex bonus is denied:

Flat-Footed
A character who has not yet acted during a combat is flat-footed, unable to react normally to the situation. A flat-footed character loses his Dexterity bonus to AC 

A non-exhaustive list of other situation where dex is denied is: flat-footed condition, blinded condition, invisibility spell, helpless condition, paralyzed condition, stunned, …

1 Like

Just to make sure I understand it correctly: do you mean Dex to AC is denied too often or not often enough?

For me it looks like they just messed up the words, so the flat-footed descriptor in the game is Denied Dex to AC in pnp and what is called flat-footed in pnp is… I guess
this.ForceFlatFooted || !this.Target.CombatState.CanActInCombat
So this would rather be refactoring than fixing at best.

Maybe it’s refactoring, is sure threw out some modders.
I just offered being their voice here since it’s easier to write these things myself than to have them subscribe to a forum, so I can’t really answer every little detail.

What I know for sure is that they also told me to add the fact that concealment shouldn’t be enough to proc sneak attacks (apparently, I have not tested, distortion is enough to make sneak attacks in P:K).

Good point, didn’t think about modding here. It’s irrelevant for players but it surely is confusing for modders, good point!

Don’t know about concealment here, your code snippet says:
total concealment + enemy can’t ignore concealment => flat-footed (the games ff. , not the tabletops)

Makes sense logically, but I don’t know if this exactly matches pnp rules. Anyway good point bringing it up!

It does not. PnP rules are that an invisible opponent (one that has total concealment) ignores the defender’s Dex to AC (obviously, some circumstances allow one to ignore this, like having the Uncanny Dodge ability).

For instance, a flat-footed character cannot make attacks of opportunity, unless he has Combat Reflexes (if he has Uncanny Dodge, he is not flat-footed at all), but one can make attacks of opportunity against other oppponents even if one is faced with an opponent with total concealment.

I don’t know how the game deals with such a situation. I think they are taken into account, but I’m not completely sure.