Azata Sword Saint III: Kill B. (Spoilers for chapter 4)

Don’t need luck to hit 84 AC, just some skill.

You’ll see.

Dirge is bad because Courage is so difficult to replace. Eventually you get Frightful Aspect, can use Cornugan/Dreadful/Mythic DD before then.

Looking forward to it :slight_smile:

These seem to be difficult trade offs, aside from Frightful Aspect, which is just good for everyone who is in melee, but is also a level 8 spell (another plus for the Lich melee sorc). For mythic dazzling display, one would have to see if that is still effective with the malus.

1 Like

You will always have enough spells to buff as a tank, i.e. shield, magic armor, cat’s grace etc. thanks to abundant casting, which is a mythic abilitiy that IMHO every caster should take, if you do the long stretches like the storm of Drezen somewhat efficiently. But compared to a fighter or a bloodrager (2h melee), you will obviously have somewhat lower DPS.

You can do the math, if you want to, like: The Fighter will have full BAB and weapon training, and higher strength because they don’t need high intelligence or wisdom, which the magus can compensate with weapon enchantment, so that the difference will be about 2 AB on lower levels = 10% hit chance etc.

IMHO the key is to have a party that performs well in all situations, and with this build as the MC, I always had an archer as a resource friendly DPS, e.g. Lann as a ranger, or Wenduag, or Arua. The archer usually has no problem with taking down trash mobs fast, if the front line can hold. On the other hand archers are AFAIK helpless against bosses with inflated AC.

Well, that’s what the discussion with Desiderius is all about :wink: We’ll see if there are solutions.

In short: The build is an Ok-ish tank in trash mob fights - bring e.g. an archer as a dependable, resource friendly DPS for those, and bring e.g. Nenio for AoE damage and control. Then you have all situations covered.


There are other priorities that take precedence over Shatter. Shaken is nice but not the end all be all and if need be you can use Cornugan or even Demoralize on a single target. The biggest downside of Mythic Display is having to burn one of your Mythics but if you do it’s workable especially with Dirge Bonus.

Fun with Ceremonial Falcata.

The thing is the foes where you really want Shatter some are immune and the average foes which aren’t immune aren’t so hard to hit without it.

Ranged characters need a little more help since they don’t get flanking.

This is Lann finally getting some mileage out of the Combat Reflexes he starts with. Since this is TB all three of those attacks took place on the enemies’ turn.

Perfect Strike also is a big help for pure ZA Lann. He gets a lot of uses as he levels.

The key here is making sure your weapon is topped up to +5 to bypass DR (Siabre has 30 or so Adamantine) and either using a Holy weapon or finding a way to make the one you’re using Holy. Likewise Hunters get Sense Vitals, Hurricane Bow, and Aspect of Falcon which are all great.

As you can see I’ve gone away from Deadly Aim since I’m using a lot more supplemental sources of damage I just want to make sure I hit stuff.

Although I really like the sword saint myself I think @Desiderius is right here.

As a class for this exercise I chose Mutation Warrior - I think that this subclass is clearly the best of all fighter-types. It does more damage than a 2h warrior and has higher AC than a straight fighter and gets an extra bite attack (feral mutagen), so guess this one is the boss.

Lets start with the AB that this character can ramp up on his own:
20 BAB

  • 7 STR 24
  • 4 STR greater mutagen
  • 2 STR enhancement (+4 belt, might be better ones)
  • 4 (greater) weapon focus, mythic weapon focus
  • 4 weapon training
  • 5 weapon enchantment +5
    = 46 so there is no way that he could do it alone

Let’s add some help from the party
46 stand-alone

  • 4 outflank
  • 4 greater heroism
  • 2 legendary proportions (+3 due to size strenght, -1 size penalty)
  • 1 haste
  • 2 bard’s inspired courage (could go up to +4 but my party bard changes to freebooter after getting dirge)
  • 3 freebooter’s favored enemy
  • 2 freebooter’s bond
  • 3 Skald Inspired Rage
  • 2 rage spell
  • 5 paladin’s aura of justice (could go even higher depending on CHA)
  • 6 cleric’s sacred hearth (could go even higher depending on WIS)
    = 80 so with the help of a melee-focused party almost every full BAB-attack would hit B.

but hey, what about MC’s mythic path? Lets assume Angel which gives divine power for an additional +6 luck bonus and +2 sacred from eaglesoul and we sit at +88.

Now we haven’t done any brown-fur-transmuter stuff. I you take one of these guys into your group he will eventually increase buff-bonuses as follows:

  • 2 from additional +4 STR enhancement
  • 2 from additional +2 Size enhancement (legendary p. or frightful)
  • 2 from additional +4 WIS on sacred hearth caster
  • 2 from additional +4 CHA on paladin
    = 96 AB

Discount some AB-bonuses because they might not be available at the time you meet B (base STR 24, mutation warriors greater mutagen, BFT capstone, etc.) would still leave enough AB to hit with most attacks

1 Like

Looks good in theory, let’s see a practice run :-).

Are you sure that all those bonuses stack/are supposed to stack?

Party setup will be locked in, I see. You need a Paladin, a Freebooter, a Skald, a Bard, a Cleric, and an Arcanist in addition to the MC, so some multiclassing has to be used. The Skald was broken in earlier versions but may be usable now or with the next patch that is supposed to come soon.

Hearth is Sacred so you can get that from Touch of Good which frees you up for Touch of Law or Luck. Insight shld be True Strike for 20. Luck bonus can get up to six with Divine Power. I know of a source of + 4 Profane STR.

Right - the downside of all these three is that they are one round only (vs. e.g. sacred hearth lasting hours) but yes, you can turbo-charge AB even further with these

Now that’s entirely new to me, sounds interesting - what is the source?

It’s far more interesting than just that. I’ll let you find it for yourself. Don’t think it’s working yet in any case.

pretty sure they work together just like that - will test with a full party when the next beta hits and update my current party composition

yes - I optimize the party heavily for melee synergies

Pretty sure Companions are set up the way they are in Wrath to get people out of that rut.

My current Aeon run lacks Bard, Alchemist, and Freebooter (and has Oracle Daeran instead of a Cleric) and is doing a fine job getting there. Illusionist Nenio is a nonbo but too good to give up.

Hit 71AB on Hard. Meh. Too much stuff bugging out to spend much more time on it. Legendary Proportions would add what 4 more? Touch of Good and you’re up to the 84 or whatever.


Reg not getting his Armor Training here, almost getting him killled.

Bronze Mask ability random finishes him off but Daeran there with the Breath of Life. One benefit of killing things quickly is you don’t have to worry about rezzed characters getting ganked when they stand up.

Once nice thing about making Lann a Nature Boy is that eventually Sense Vitals does get there.

Regill wrecking face. You can see Order of the Godclaw bugging out here as well. He has the Thug ability via Hellknight so when he kills something to trigger Dreadful Carnage it’s Ever Ready time for the team.

Wolj had a quest nearby so first time I’ve played him this run. For some reason Debilitating Strike not triggering.

Aeon long duration buff Equal Force showing up.

Lann’s mount tanking. Have yet to see Mounted abilities trigger.

On the other hand Tandem Trip works great with Urban Hunter mounted.

Finally this is why you don’t splash with Seelah. That level 17 ability is gold.

Impressive! Still a way to go, as you need to get AB to, I guess, around 100 or something to hit B. reliably enough. I don’t know how much damage you actually need to do to win the fight, as the health bar seems to be unreliable. I hit him for 100 + damage in the first round but almost did not make a dent, then 600 finished him of, but this likely means you need at least several hits.
I am a little worried looking at how much is still not working, looking at the release deadline.

1 Like

We’ll see today I guess.

Have to play with B to see how hard flatfooted is to get. These shots are without Holy Weapon so that would help with damge.

You say you are sword saint 17, scalded fist 1, bloodrager 2 and azata.

Hypothetical question:
If you want to be all chaotic for role playing reasons would it be a good idea to be instinctual warrior 2?
You get wis to AC, rage (that improves wis instead of con) and uncanny dodge but not crane style and bloodline power.

Yes, I can see how that could work. It is an interesting trade-off. Also that the instinctual warrior adds her wisdom modifier to initiative is interesting for the build. One would choose a different background, the “Martial Discipline”, to get the “improved unarmored strike” feat in this case, if one wants to use the crane style feats. And instead of loosing 2 AC you would gain 1 AC from the wisdom bonus while raging. The celestial bloodline is neat for bypassing damage reduction, but there are other sources for that, and the 1d6 additional damage gets irrelevant quickly.

BTW: You can be chaotic, you just cannot start with that alignment as a monk. So far WotR does not have any of the “requires chaotic” kind of choices you can only make if you already are chaotic, at least I did not notice any.

Another side note:

You can take any monk archetype that get’s wisdom to AC. I tried Sensei, because I wanted to test if the Azata songs stack with the Sensei song (they did not). If you choose Scaled Fist, you would need to go Charisma instead of Wisdom, for which I see no reason, as the MC does not need persuasion, or any other char based skills, but profits from the + to will saves.

1 Like

Sorry for the wrong monk. I get confused between all the different builds we discuss.

If you take one early level of monk it should work with everything, but an azata or trickster monk would not work. I mean many monk levels later.

If you’re splashing Monk Traditional gets an extra +2 Will save. As you note though WUS to Initiative is outstanding, but I’d only bother with any of that if you’re a WIS-based class. High level Saint abilities are insane and you want to keep growing your Arcane Pool and Arcana abilities.

Crane Wings is supposed to work only with 1 free hand.
Crane Riposte is divided in 2 parts: first part (You take only a –1 penalty on attack rolls for fighting defensively) is always working while second part ( Whenever you deflect an opponent’s attack using Crane Wing or lose the dodge bonus from Crane Wing because an attack missed you by 4 or less, you can make an attack of opportunity against the attacker after the attack misses.) works only if Crane Wings is working.